The Nourished Woman with Keri Marino

Midlife, Menopause & Coming Home to Your Body with Bonnie Papajohn

• Keri Marino • Episode 24

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What if midlife wasn’t the beginning of decline, but the start of your most powerful, connected chapter yet? In this episode, I sit down with menopause and midlife health coach Bonnie Papajohn to talk honestly about what’s really happening in your body—and how to work with it, not against it.


We cover the full picture of perimenopause and menopause: hormonal shifts, brain fog, fatigue, changing metabolism, and the stress that makes it all harder. 


Bonnie shares her own midlife reset—surgical menopause, separation, burnout—and how she rebuilt her energy and confidence through gentle, sustainable changes: mindful eating, simple meals, and somatic practices that calm the nervous system fast. We dig into why the diets and workouts that worked at 35 don’t always serve at 50, how to reduce inflammation, balance blood sugar, and build steadier energy without extremes.


If you’re craving clearer thinking, deeper rest, and a kinder relationship with your changing body, this episode will remind you that midlife isn’t the end—it’s a recalibration.

About Bonnie

Bonnie Papajohn is the founder of Dahlia Health & Nutrition Coaching and a certified health, nutrition, and menopause specialist with over 15 years in the wellness industry. After navigating her own midlife transformation, she now supports women in feeling strong, confident, and in control of their health through personalized coaching rooted in nutrition, movement, and mindset. Bonnie is passionate about helping women embrace the shift and thrive in every season of life.

Check out her website and Instagram.

About Keri

Keri is the founder of The Nourished Woman and a Somatic Yoga Therapist who supports women in feeling more alive, grounded, and at home in their bodies. Through a calm, gently spiritual approach, she creates spaces for women to explore healing, reconnect with themselves, and move through life with greater ease and confidence. With over 16 years of experience, Keri guides yoga and somatic practices that honor the nervous system, the body’s wisdom, and the fullness of being human.

Find out more about Keri on her website or Instagram. 

If you love the sound of short daily somatic yoga rituals that help you become a more radiant woman, with bottomless pleasure and aliveness. 

Get instant access to 150+ nervous system practices made for women on everyday topics like: digestive health, back care, period relief, core strength and emotional well-being. 

Try a 7 day free trial of The Nourished Woman Sanctuary here. 

SPEAKER_00:

Welcome to the Nourished Woman Podcast, a space for women who've been doing the work to grow and heal and are ready to feel good again, body, mind, and soul. I'm your host, Carrie Marino, somatic yoga therapist of over 16 years, mentor and mama of three. I help women like you fall in love with how yoga makes you feel. Alchemi the hard things you've been through and experience more pleasure and aliveness in your body and relationships. I'm so glad you're here. Let's dive in.

SPEAKER_01:

I just know I can't survive. Without mysteries.

SPEAKER_00:

And she is an expert in the arena of women's health and fitness and a menopause specialist. And she came to this journey in her own midlife, really figuring out how to thrive personally and then sharing that work with all of her clients. Bonnie, I'm so excited to have you here with me today.

SPEAKER_02:

Thank you so much, Carrie. I'm thrilled to be here.

SPEAKER_00:

So I'd love to tell our listeners where we met. We met at a business coach's event locally. And you're one of those people that you have this sort of calm, grounded, and kind energy. And I really appreciated that about you right from the start because in those business coaching environments, sometimes it's like the egos are out, if you know what I mean. And you had this just sort of easeful steadiness about you. And then we went to coffee, I got to know you a little bit more. And one of the things that I just so resonate about your approach, and I'm so excited for all of our listeners to hear our conversation, is because so for context, I went to clinical nutrition school. I don't know if you know that about me. I have a background diet.

SPEAKER_02:

Remember, you told me that.

SPEAKER_00:

And so I've always been in the nutrition world, it's always been a hobby of mine. And I meet a lot of people who get really extreme in this arena, like as professionals. And I love that your approach and everyone listening, if you're already feeling a little triggered because you're like, we have a health and nutrition and menopause specialist on deck for today. Oh no! I don't talk about the things. Bonnie is so grounded, she is down to earth, and you do not make this overly complicated. Like you really do meet women in the real life experiences. You're not out there preaching like crazy smoothie recipes that you have to buy ingredients from coastal for or like just obscure shit, right? Like real practical difference-making stuff. And I so appreciate that because so many women I talk to, and maybe you listening right now, like this just feels overly complicated and it feels confusing. And I feel like you do a great job of distilling it down and giving women real information they can use.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, well, thanks for that because I know for a fact, having worked with many women over the years, that one of those types of regimented situations when it comes to health is not going to work long term. So I I kind of lived it, and so now I'm passing it on to other people.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, and it can also be like in my so I have a background in eating disorders personally and working with clients who are recovering. And it can oftentimes actually fall into disordered eating territory under the guise of clean eating or eating healthy. Yeah. And I feel like the approach that you have is very much about like what real health looks like, not surface level stuff.

SPEAKER_02:

Exactly. It's it's what I call we're gonna get down to middle earth. We're gonna figure, we're gonna figure it out in the middle earth and work from there and work out. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

That's a good analogy and so suiting of your personality. We're gonna get to middle earth. Well, Bonnie, my favorite question to start us off with is what is so nourishing for you right now? And it could be mentally or physically or emotionally or energetically or relationally, just something that you're like, oh, this just feels so good in my life right now.

SPEAKER_02:

So, as a health and nutrition coach, I'm always getting questions about different types of foods, right? That's obvious. That's what people want to know about. So, one thing that I started to cultivate this year was learning more about herbs and how they affect the body and how they can feel the body because they've been around for many, many, many years. And so I am making, I'm experimenting with making teas for people and for myself to see how that feels and just the joy of working with. I mean, I'm a big gardener, so I love plants to begin with. That's my thing. But I love just taking the different herbs that I'm organized, I'm actually buying from a co-op and putting together things for people that and for myself that are grounding and nourishing and healing. And the response I'm getting is just is wonderful. So that to me right now is kind of like my space of when I'm not coaching people or you know, I gotta be doing something that's to me purposeful, and that's purposeful. So that's kind of what's exciting to me. And then I'm also kind of cultivating my empath skills. I'm trying to learn and go deeper with that. And that's been a quite an interesting journey for me too. So it's it's um really makes me feel whole when I when I'm doing that.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. And I'm curious, do you have a favorite herbal blend, like just for you individually, that you are loving right now?

SPEAKER_02:

Um I do the one that I'm mostly working on, and I cultivate this from for me mainly because I have to deal with autoimmune situations with my health. So I need to work with anti-inflammatory. So I'm doing a lot of ginger and turmeric, some peppermint, some things like that that help really help heal me. So I can be the best coach I can be. So I'm I'm doing lots of stuff with anti-inflammatory um ingredients right now.

SPEAKER_00:

That's amazing. And I feel like each of those have such an aroma. I'm imagining as you're as you're creating these herb blends, you're smelling it, you're seeing the beauty of the herbs, you're brewing yourself a cup of tea or maybe fusion. And it's that like there's that satisfaction of watching it brew and then actually enjoying it.

SPEAKER_02:

That's so good. It's fantastic. It's so calming, and and it, and it's it benefits me. And that's great.

SPEAKER_00:

On so many different levels, and also brings you into the present moment, right? That entire experience just kind of like shoom, you're in the here and the now. And empath, what are you learning about yourself as an empath?

SPEAKER_02:

So I've known this my whole life. I mean, I've always known that I had something that kind of made me different, but I never cultivated it. I put it on the back burner. And as I've come into the coaching space, one-on-one coaching space in the past five, six years, it's made me really realize that I have a lot more than just I have an intuition or I have a connection that I'm that is usually pretty spot on when it comes to someone's health or things that they're concerned about or worried about. And so I'm just trying to just see what what that looks like and and and allowing it to happen instead of putting it on the back burner and going, nope, don't listen to that, don't listen to that, don't listen to that. I want to listen to it, I want to embrace it. So I'm I'm learning how to do that. And it's it's very scientifically based and it's very fascinating.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, scientifically, but also intuitive. Intuit, yeah. Yeah, I feel that as you're talking. It's like, how can I really lean into that intuitive knowing with your clients? And truthfully, what a time saver for our clients. I use intuition in my practice a lot.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

And not that you're saying that your empathic skills or intuition are better than their own inner knowing, but it's never right. Whatever. Ladies who are listening, you your highest self knows better than any of us could ever. But we can be a mirror in a faster way when we are able to tune in and get that sort of intuitive knowing with women. Yeah, yeah, it's really cool. Well, I'm glad that that's feeling nourishing for you and appearing like all these different levels, like physically and emotionally and professionally and spiritually, it's nourishing for you.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, and it all goes together for me. I mean, when you own your own business, it's you don't you really shut off. You you're on constantly thinking or cultivating something new. So all of this kind of just is is wrapped in a nice little package for me, and it I take it with me everywhere I go.

SPEAKER_00:

So yeah, that's wonderful. Well, I'd love to give our listeners a little bit of your backstory because I know it seems like there was a career change, you were going through a marriage transition, you were going through a lot of health things. Can you tell us a little bit about your past and then what informed the woman that you've become today?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, when I think back on my my journey, so to speak, it it really there's a lot of moments where I'm going, now it all makes sense. At the time I didn't understand it. It started with a separation at age 50. And I had had a hysterectomy in October, right before I turned 50. And then four months later I separated. So I went into full-blown menopause at the same time. So it was all, you know, it was it was a mess. And and I didn't have a whole lot of support. So I was trying to figure all this out on my own. But at 50, I was 50 years old. I had been working some, I'd raised my children. I knew I had to make a career out of what I love to do. And that was I was a personal trainer part-time and a fitness instructor. So I just decided to turn that into a full-time job. And and that's what I did. I went through some pretty bad stress-related issues, obviously, from the from the from the separation, and was not eating well, nurturing myself. I was doing things that I hadn't done in years that were just dumb. And one day I just said I can't do this anymore. And I decided I needed to start to feel better. And the way I started to feel better was learning how to cook for myself, to nourish my body on my own. And then as I was coaching these clients at uh when I was training these clients at, I was working for the sports club at the time, which is now ACAC, I was hearing all this stuff from them. And, you know, I wanted to be able to help them more on a deeper level than just saying, yeah, do this, do that, this works, this doesn't work. So I started I started exploring health coaching. So I got a health coaching certification and really learned how to help other women on a deeper level through through lifestyle changes, through stress management. Then I got my nutrition certification and my menopause certification. So I could learn how to really deeply help them because I could say stuff all day long. Kind of goes back to that intuition thing I was talking about. Intuitively, I kind of knew what to tell them, but I wanted to be able to back it up a little bit more. And and then at 60, I was working for a local primary care physician. I learned had learned a bunch from them. Um, I was a their health and nutrition coach at the at their practice, and I worked with weight loss clients. And I just said, it's time for me to do this on my own. So at 60, I launched Dahlia Health and Nutrition, and it's the best thing I've ever done for myself. And it's never like never too late to make a change.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely. And what an inspiration. I feel like I I meet so many women in my practice who are in those like the 50s and 60s, and it's a reevaluative period because you're you're realizing that those advanced ages that you knew were coming are coming faster, right? Like you're closer to some of those advanced ages. Health issues are a lot more loud and noticeable. And oftentimes it can be a defeating place, right? Like we can just kind of slip into old patterns and to get into some of like part of what yoga is ultimately wanting us to do is make peace with our own mortality, which sounds weird to say, but that's like the ultimate change that we're all gonna go through. And I think having that perspective of like, I am getting older, what do I want these years ahead of me to look like?

SPEAKER_01:

Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Like I actually get to decide what I want these years of my life to look like and how rich I want them to be, and how able-bodied I want to be, and how I want to feel. And you really are an example of a woman who is willing to say, Holy crap, a lot of things happened.

SPEAKER_02:

A lot happened.

SPEAKER_00:

A lot happened there. And oh my gosh, what do I want to create for myself? And it's never too late for me to keep asking myself that question.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. And a lot of what I do with the the clients I work with, I we talk about that a bunch about empowerment, advocacy, education. So they understand what's happening to their bodies and that they have a choice. They have a choice of how they want to proceed, and I help guide them through that. And that's extremely satisfying.

SPEAKER_00:

It's it's where the magic happens, right? And I think part of part of what the gift of what you and I are doing in the world is showing women other possibilities and then saying, like, hey, babe, you get to have it too. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

Sky's the limit as far as I'm concerned. And I'm when and I know I've I haven't gone into all the gory details, but when I tell you I hit rock bottom, I hit rock bottom.

SPEAKER_00:

Can you tell us a little more about that rock bottom? I mean, uh, you don't have to get into it if you don't want to, but if it feels like you can talk about it in a powerful way.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, I think what it all boils down to is that I felt lonely for the first time in my entire life. I'd been alone, because we all have a lone time, but I'd never been lonely.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

And I had moved out of my house that my kids had grown up in, because that's the way it had to happen for me to be able to separate, and moved into an apartment. And it was like I was like on vacation for about a month. It felt like this is the best thing ever. And then the loneliness hit and it was gut-wrenching. It was like on the floor, curled up in a ball with my dog staring at me, going, Oh, what's wrong with you? And a glass of wine's on the countertop. And, you know, I might have even smoked a couple of cigarettes. You know, here, your personal trainer smoking cigarettes, hadn't done that since college. So I just I I just was I was teaching four or five spin classes a week. I was going to yoga two or three times a week. I was coaching client clients at 5 a.m. in the morning. I'd go back and coach them again at night. So I put myself in this spiral of absolute, I don't even know. I was exhausted. Like I didn't know if I should come home at lunch and eat, take a shower, or take a nap. I didn't know what I should do. I would just come home and just be miserable. But that kind of is what spurred me when, like I said earlier in my little synopsis, is I just said, I can't do this anymore. This is not healthy for me. I have grown children that I still need to support and and take care of and love and and and I had a family that I that loved me and supported me. And I will say, if I did not have the friends and family unit that I had, I would it that was tremendous for me to help me get out of it. But once I figured out I wasn't stuck, and basically you look down at your feet and you're not stuck in any kind of cement or concrete, you can move one foot in front of the other, I made a change. So when I that's what I mean about rock bottom, it was pretty darn low.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And low on several different levels. And your nervous system was probably just in like it was in survival mode. Constant survival. And some of that was self-inflicted, some of that was situational. And then I hear you saying also, like, I put myself in situations that exacerbated that.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, definitely. And I think that was part of the problem for me is I felt guilty for putting myself in that situation, even though I knew it was the right situation to be in. I still had, and you know, that's that old mom guilt that comes in that you know, you took care of your kids and now you're leaving, and you know, it's it's it was a lot. It was a lot. And you know, 14 years later or 12 years later, I still unpack it. I'm still unpacking it.

SPEAKER_00:

So I'm so glad, like what a relief that our healing and our breakthroughs come in cycles. Like we don't have to process it all at once. And I'm sure there are certain times of the year where you're like, oh yeah, and another layer peels away. And also I am so here for all the stories of women just being real and saying, I went through this shitty shit shit. And some of it was me, and some of it was the situation, and here's how I stood in my power, and here's how I made something beautiful with it. And I feel that you've done that, and I really just want to reflect that back to you. You've turned into something that is a gift outward, and that what greater what greater gift can an imprint can we make on this world?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. And sometimes we don't, you know, we don't know as women if we raise our children and and we may work or we may not work, and and everyone's gonna do what's gonna be best for them, but we lose ourselves in that. And I lost myself in that. And so at 50, and my kids are in college and I'm separated, I'm like, oh shit. What's my you know, what's gonna serve me now? So what's gonna make me so it had to hit the rot bottom in order to figure out what that was. And then now, you know, like you said, it's an ongoing, it's an ongoing thing, but I know my purpose now. There's no doubt in my mind what my purpose is now.

SPEAKER_00:

And I'm imagining that you've built a whole love story with yourself now, like being a woman who is overfunctioning and can give and can pour and can nurture and can show up and love and manage all of the things that go with the marriage and a household and a career and children. It can be so easy to put yourself last. And I feel like societally, we even encourage that. Like women, especially your generation, are very encouraged to be that woman. Yeah, there is there can be those feelings of being lost, and also I feel like the work that you do and the work that I do is really inviting women to write a love story with themselves. And I see you in that. I think that the way you relate to yourself now is so much, so much more beautiful than you probably ever thought was before.

SPEAKER_02:

I can't even tell you how much better it is.

SPEAKER_00:

What a gift that is. I know. Well, I'm curious about those desires that you had for yourself. I know you had the recognition of this just isn't working. And then what were those desires? What were you wanting for yourself when you decided to make those changes?

SPEAKER_02:

Number one, I wanted to feel better physically. Even though I was doing all the exercise, I was leaving a spin class and going to Chick-fil-A or going to culverse or wherever and picking up fast food and eating that fast food. Yeah. And I was drinking a lot more than I than I should have that I ever did, which was kind of stupid, but that's just kind of what I was doing. But then I just decided I wanted to feel better again. I wanted to physically feel not worn out all the time. And so my desire mainly was just to get kind of back on my feet physically first. And I figured if I got back on my feet physically through nutrition, then mentally that would probably follow suit. And that's pretty much what happened. I mean, I was seeing a therapist this whole time and she was amazing. But you know, you you gotta make these decisions on your own in your own time. People can't force you into something. So I had to I had to figure out that physically I needed to have that energy to do the things I wanted to do. And I knew I wanted to have my own job. I knew I wanted to start a new career. I knew I wanted to have my own business at some point, and I couldn't do it where I was. There's just no way. So that was a very passionate for me to have at some point not have to work for someone else. I wanted to work for myself.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely. And I also heard you talking about your family and your kids and how you wanted to be there for them and for those up those people who really held your heart and helped you along. That desire to really show up in those relationships in the way you wanted to.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. And you can't do that when you're wallowing in yourself. You know, or you're or you're or you're tr or treating yourself badly. You it that trickles down badly to everybody else. But if you're treating yourself well, it trickles down in a very positive way to the family unit and your friends and and your coworkers or whoever you know are in your life.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. It makes so much more room for presence and connection when you're in that state of being nourished inside and out. Sure. Yeah. Well, I'm curious, you mentioned stress as part of it. So can you speak a little bit about how stress has been part of your journey and then also how you see that in your client's journey as well?

SPEAKER_02:

I think honestly, stress is probably the number one thing that I'm seeing in my clients right now. And I'm talking about women who are usually in their mid-40s, some closer to 50, depending on you know where they're at. But I'm seeing the stress of maybe they have a full-time career, maybe they have two kids in school and they're trying to take the kids to this and that and do all the things. And I get stressed when they're telling me this. This is why like I'm like I'm picking up on your stuff, right?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So it is so prevalent. And so one thing that, and what drew me to you when I'm when we met was that there needed to be something besides just taking a deep breath every now and again, or you know, whatever your self-care looked like at the time. I mean, it could be whatever. It could be, it could be reading a book or walking in the yard or whatever. And I don't doubt any self, or it could be getting a pedicure, it doesn't matter. It's all whatever you need. But I needed something deeper for my clients. I needed something that they got on a deeper level. And that's where the somatic yoga sound is so amazing to me to learn how to work the nervous system the way you know you teach it, and the the way the somatic yoga therapy is or however whatever, whatever the right word is. And so I started exploring different ways for to help me and different ways to help my clients do that. And it could be anything from grounding meditations, which I'm working on doing myself, which is I'm really struggling, but it's I'm I'm getting there. And I've I've I listened to your podcast on meditations. I'm like, okay, I can do this. So just finding other ways to help people with the stress because it affects if they're not able to de-stress, they're not gonna lose the weight, they're not gonna feel better, they're gonna be in constant chaos. Like you said, their cortisol levels are high. Some of the women I've worked with, we've done some cortisol testing on, and their cortisol is just so out of whack because their their schedules are just not, you know, they're just nuts. And so that to me is like, okay, I need to make this part of my program so I can I can help women find a way to navigate this stressful life that they live.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. That holding too much. Like so many women are holding way too much. And it almost becomes the norm. Like when they have, for example, I had a woman reach out to me recently and she wants to work with me one-to-one, and she was talking about how, like, even when she gets time alone, she does not know how to choose herself in that moment. She'll clean the dishes or do a craft, or like, but those are not the things that she wants to be doing, like a practice for herself. Right. So the stress can almost become so much a norm that people don't even see it anymore.

SPEAKER_02:

I think that's true. I think it is the norm. I think I think women, especially, and I work mainly with women, so I'm not trying to knock the guys, I just work mainly with women. They almost sometimes I feel like they almost thrive on it because socially, the busier you're the busier you are, the more successful you're supposed to be, which is just bullshit because I bought into that shit when I was in my 30s and 40s, and look what happened to me, you know. So I I feel like it is just the norm, and I want it not to be.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. And it sounds like it's a key part of how you see your clients get the results that they want.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

They can bring the stress levels down and actually get the quality sleep and have the cortisol cortisol levels regulate and feel more at ease and at home mentally and emotionally and physically. And that's where yoga, as you know and we know, is so hugely beneficial for us.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. I send every one of my clients your yoga video that you made for me and my client. I just they get it like the second session. I'm like, here, you gotta promise me you'll do this. Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

It's only I think it's only like 10 minutes. It's 10 minutes. Okay, you can do this. You can do 10 minutes. Come on. Yes, I love that. Yeah. Well, I feel like stress is one of those things, like part of the cycles that I have to help my clients out of are the stress patterns. Yeah. And a lot of those stress, and I know you're doing this too, and I just want to speak to that a little bit about those stress patterns that we see. And then, like for me, a lot of stress patterns that I see are psycho-emotional and lifestyle-based patterns. So it's like thinking that they have to be a certain way or do a certain thing or that this is gonna go wrong or that that shoe's gonna drop, or like all the different pressure that we put on ourselves to be a certain way, like that kind of psychoemotional stress, and then also the lifestyle dynamics. Like, what habits have we created in our marriage or in our relationships or in the our work that then are contributors to stress?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. And I will say that one thing I do hear a lot from women is spousal stress, not necessarily, you know, uh they want to get divorced or separated, but they're kind of like, what the hell? Why do I hate them now? Like, why can't I why can't I, you know, be happy or or whatever. So I do see that as a as a big issue for a lot of the a lot of the women that I work with. Also, job stress, you know, they need to produce or they need to be better at their job. They think they do anyways. And then the stress of just like you said, just like I'm just keeping up with the Joneses. And then the political stress, that's a whole, that's a whole nother ball game. And I have a lot of clients that are very stressed out about the way the world is going. So it's coming at us from a hundred different places. And it's kind of like, whoa, where do I stop first? Like, where do where do you put the where do you put the big X up? Like, don't come near me, don't come near me. But so I think sometimes that's hard for women, like which what do I tackle first? You know, we can't control the stressors, right? But we can try to figure out ways to to control the way we react to them.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, absolutely. And I'm hearing, and I I you know I know this professionally, and I want our listeners to hear this too. I just want to make it very obvious that these stresses accumulate, and then by the time you're in the middle stage of your life, you can no longer ignore the things that are going on. Like it becomes way more obvious what is happening in your body to a point that you have to pay attention. And in your mental health, the same, and in your relationships, like we can get by to a certain point, but for a lot of women, that point where they can no longer get by is in that middle stage of life.

SPEAKER_02:

Right. Definitely. I that is probably when it hits the most for most women. That's what it hit me.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. So, what are for my listeners who are not yet in there, they know that perimenopause is something that will come in the future because some of my listeners are in there, like they're gonna get pregnant or they're having their baby. Some of my listeners are post the years of having their babies, but and they're and gonna be entering perimenopause. Some of my listeners are in peri or menopause, and some are past. Sure. I'd love for you to kind of give us a picture of those, those, that arc in a woman's life, and then some of what's happening in her body or hormonally, or some of the different changes that she's gonna see. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, for sure. I actually went into perimenopause at age 38. That's when my doctor said you're in perimenopause. And I just was going, what? You know, and what what it how it manifested first for me was night sweats and really bad periods. So you a lot of times women will will will have first the night, the night sweats. Maybe they'll have bad periods, maybe they'll find that they've gained a little bit of weight that they didn't know, like I haven't changed anything, I'm not sure why I'm gaining weight, or maybe oh, exercise that they were doing isn't working for them anymore. So they need to readjust that. Maybe a certain food that they've always eaten that they thought was nourishing and healthy now isn't for them. So biologically, we change so much. Insulin resistance changes, visceral fat starts to kind of connect a little bit more. So it's being aware of these changes, just to kind of make note. And what I tell all my I have several clients that are in perimenopause, they're they're like in their early 40s. I'm like, just note some things that happen to you. Like, how do you feel certain times of the month? And if you have a big concern about that, then take those notes to your doctor when you have your checkup and talk to your doctor about it and see what they have to say. And then I tell them how to talk to their doctor because they don't know how to talk to their doctor, which I didn't either. So I get that. So there's that that first shift, and that can be anything, something super small, it could be really big. For me, it was really big. It hit me like bam. Like, what's wrong with me? And then through my 40s, and most women will tell me they suddenly feel like they can't multitask anymore. Maybe they're maybe they have a little bit of brain fog or they're not sleeping as well as they were. So, what does that look like? How can we help you through that that process of getting back on track with that? So it all kind of culminates, you know. Menopause is when you've not had a period for a year, or you have been in like mine was a surgical induced menopause from a hysterectomy. I went was not in menopause one day and then two hours later I'm in menopause. So it can come in very, very quickly. So it and everyone's gonna be different. There's no, there's no cookie cutter with this at all. Every some women won't experience anything. They'll just fly through it. I mean, they're they're they're going through it because if you're lucky enough to live to go through menopause, you're gonna go through menopause. I mean, that's just what happens. And then postmenopausal women, you know, once you're in menopause, you're you're in menopause for the rest of your life. That's just what it is. So your estrogen is depleting, your progesterone is depleting, your testosterone might be depleting. So a lot of women want to work at ways to balance their hormones. Some want to go on hormone replacement therapy, and some want to try to do it as naturally as they can. And I have a whole theory about that we can go into, but and not a not, I'm not a doctor, I'm not a medical professional. I'm, you know, I'm a lay person, but just my experiences of the types of people that I've worked with. I'm all for HRT and because it saved my life. I really do feel like it did. But I had to do other the other work too. That wasn't the only thing that that helped me. I had to do all the other work as well.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

But, you know, have one woman that has chronic hip problems and frozen shoulder. That's a perimenopause, paramen, you know, menopause symptoms. So it's just thinking about what what your body's going through and how do you feel, and then take note of it. And there's ways to make it better. I promise everyone, there are ways to make it better. You we just have to find out what works for you.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. And I hear that self-awareness is a part of the puzzle. Huge. And I want our listeners to hear me and you say this that the more you're tuned in and paying attention to your body, the earlier you can get your body the support that it needs. And so if you are a woman who kind of overrides communication from your body or you never really built that skill, then this would be a great part of like your preventative strategy for thriving through perimenopause and menopause is to develop a heightened level of awareness and connection to your body. I know mindful eating, you did a lead journey for some of my clients inside the Nourished Woman Sanctuary.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm right.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Mindful eating was part of that puzzle. And so I want everyone to know that the skills you're building in yoga can actually help wire you up to navigate this time with more ease because you're gonna have an advantage. You're gonna be more aware of what's going on and then take in a position to take action sooner.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes. And I I will tell anybody that, you know, they're when is when should I start? I'm like, well, now, you know, are you even if you're 28, start working on that now because it will benefit you so much. And the women who are younger are gonna have a little, I think, a better time of this because people are talking about it now. When I was going through it, my doctor kind of looked at me like, I want to help you, but I don't really know what to do, you know, I don't know how to do this. And she was amazing, but she didn't they didn't learn about that in in medical school. They spent like two hours on it. Yeah. So so women, these younger women, if they know they can lay the like you said, lay the groundwork for the preventative, that's just gonna make their their their their they're gonna thrive more than than not through this the the the phase of perimenopause and menopause. Yeah. Um and I'm I think that it's and I I actually have been a very healthy eater for most of my life, but uh you know, some people are gonna are just more prone to having symptoms than others. So, but when I did start to recheck the the nutrition for me, I got so much better. Like if I just felt so much better. So I know the nutrition played a huge part in it for me and the exercise too.

SPEAKER_00:

And the stress reduction, yeah. Yeah, oh yeah. Those are huge in your method for helping women. Definitely, yeah. I also want to talk a little bit about there's almost like a rebrand, which I love to call it that, because I'm like, this is an intentional rebrand on the on the part of women of really talking about perimenopause now at all. Because growing up for me, I never even heard about perimenopause. Like nobody was conversing about that. It was always about the change, and you didn't even use the word menopause. Like when I look to my elders, they were talking about the change. And now women are talking about this out loud. There are women like you out there who are menopause specialists. I also have heard the term cougar puberty, and it just I fucking love it so much.

SPEAKER_02:

What's so funny about that that you say that is my partner's 12 years younger than me. And he's so I'm that I I must have had that happen to me then cougar puberty.

SPEAKER_00:

It just makes me so happy. I'm like, yes, I shall hit puberty again, and it will be cougar puberty.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, that's kind of what happens to your body when you go through menopause. You are kind of doing an adult onset puberty. It's it's like all the changes are very fast and furious. So it's it's very similar.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, and how fun that we get to call it something like that rather than like I feel like it was for the longest time it was looked at this negative thing. And I'm so glad women like you are out there saying, like, no, honey, let's thrive. Yeah, this is a beautiful time in our lives. How can we rock it?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, yeah. And I and I think that's part of the reason I do what I do is because I see I see the potential in everyone. Yeah. And I want them to reach that potential. I want them to thrive. I want them to be successful. I don't want it for me. I want it for them. I want them to be able to say, look what I've done. This is how I feel. You know, our mothers didn't talk about, especially women my age and in their you know, 50s and 60s. Our mothers didn't talk about it. And their mothers certainly didn't talk about it. But it's funny because I have a store, a funny story with my mom. I might we're like, mom, you know, my sister and are like, you didn't tell us anything about menopause. And she said, Well, I don't really think, you know, I didn't have any symptoms. And we're like going, oh yes, you did. You had a lot of symptoms. You just were not, you just weren't going to accept it or wrap your head around it, right? Because that was just so taboo. Yeah, she's 91 right now, so she's, you know, she went to it a long time ago. But it's funny that the way that's come back around, and now it's just like, let's have that conversation at the bar, at the gym, you know, at the church, wherever we are. Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Honestly, I'm so glad that we too. As a woman who's not in perimenopause yet, I'm so glad I'm exposed to women who are talking about it and shining examples of what's possible.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Because it's so much more, it's so much of a brighter path than I think it ever has been for women to look at those, that transition that we're all going to go through if we're lucky enough to live that long.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. And I decided back in 2017, that's the woman that I wanted to work with. That's when I first became a health coach and said, I want to work with women in midlife. So I've been working with women in midlife first, you know, a lot longer than it's been, you know, people were talking about it. I remember talking about with a I had a program that I ran at the gym, and we would talk about dirt certain things, and they were hesitant to have a conversation. No, this is why we're here. We're safe. We can talk about it here in this, you know, little safe space.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Funny you say that because now it's such a trend. And like for me, I've been doing nerve, I've been teaching people nervous system work since for like over a decade.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

And it used to not be something people talked about at all. Yeah, that's a trend too. It's literally everywhere, and there's so much misinformation about it because it's everywhere. Yes. That too. Yeah. That too.

SPEAKER_02:

So if someone promised to balance promises to balance your hormones in one month, then you'll be on send you on your merry way. It's not gonna happen. No. Just so you know, it's not gonna happen.

SPEAKER_00:

So, what what are the biggest difference makers? And I I if you can, I'd love for you to kind of talk to the women in the different stages because I know you've got the frame to hold it all, even though your mid your midlife women are your primary client. What are the biggest difference makers in the mindset they have, in the choices that they're making, to set themselves up to thrive through this transition?

SPEAKER_02:

I think the biggest mindset is that it's doable. So a lot of people will come to me and say, I want to change, but I don't want to change. You know, then the background they're going, but I don't want to give up this, that, and the other. And so we learn to work on what works for their body, whether it's adding more vegetables. On a daily basis, whether it's adding more protein to their diet, whether it's adding more fiber to their diet, there's a lot of things we can do to make it a realistic thing. And that that is through perimenopause all the way. I mean, I have a 75-year-old client. I have clients, I have a 65-year-old client. I got it from 38 to 65, 75 right now. That's my range. So that's, you know. So when they realize that they can do these small incremental changes that can have an impact. And especially with my perimenopausal women who either have young children or maybe children in high school, that is something that has given them a lot of empowerment, not only just to feel better, but to be able to stand their ground better and speak better and have more power in their, you know, or more say in their house, not not as a matriarch or anything, but just, you know, this is what we need to do. You know, they just learn how to stand over themselves. I don't know how to explain that any other way. It's like giving them some power. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And then the exercise comp exercise component of it too, whether if they've never done any exercise, maybe we'll just start them walking. Just get outside in nature, let the sun hit you. We're walking the rain. That can be invigorating. You don't have to go to the gym and work out five days a week for an hour and a half. Let's just find some movement. Go to yoga, go to Pilates, go to Tai Chi. Let's find something that helps them. So I like to make that foundational with my younger clients and my all my clients, but my younger clients usually haven't really been doing that before. They've kind of just they've been working or whatever. I don't have time. Well, I get I promise you, we can find time to do these things if they really want to do it.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So when they can figure out that they can change some little baby things that they consider the baby add up to big, big giant results in the end. So in the menopause phase, it's more like, let's figure out now what you did in your 30s and 40s probably isn't working anymore. Like maybe you're not going to be do do great with HIT workouts anymore, or maybe you can't eat certain foods anymore. So let's reevaluate all that and see what works better for you now.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

And it's it's try, tweak, and try again. There's no, there's no foolproof method here. And so that's kind of where we focus on with that. And then also with women and that are in menopause, I really, really, really f let them know what's going on with their bodies and I educate them on what's happening and I let them understand that they need to talk to their healthcare professional about it when they need to. Like how do women will call me up and say, I just got the throw with my doctor's office and they won't blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, okay, let's set, let's talk about this at our next session or let's make a list of things we need to talk about, and then we'll do that for them. So I'm giving them that empowerment to speak for themselves and to speak about how they feel because they don't have to feel bad anymore. You can feel better. You can feel so much better. Yeah. And then my older clients, it's really just a kind of a maintenance thing. Like, let's just, let's once again, let's keep doing the workouts, let's figure out what works for your body, what maybe. I mean, I had one client the other day, she said, I used to get eat, I don't remember now what it was, and now I can't, and I'm so mad. And I said, Well, let's find something different. And we, you know, she's like, Okay, well, I'll try that. And she's it's fine, you know, you survive it and you feel better for making the change. I just I think that nutrition and movement are always going to be number one and number two when it all phases of of of women's lives.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely. And like good, solid nutrition, like consistent, good, solid nutrition.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, like protein and fiber and good carbs and good healthy fats. And I'm not an all or nothing coach. I don't believe in that, and I don't think that you have to give up stuff. I we just find ways to kind of follow in that 80-20 rule where 80% of the time you're doing nutrition, and the 20% that you don't, you're enjoying that 20%. It's joyful to you. It's not just I'm gonna have it because it's there. It's like, I really want that because I don't have it very often. So it can be joyful to have that 20% and not make yourself feel guilty about it.

SPEAKER_00:

They can really down the road. Yeah. So I know if if I put myself in the hat of a listener right now that they're gonna be thinking, weight, like they heard you say gain weight, or maybe they've already gained some weight. You have some experience working with women and weight loss. What are some healthy ways that women can can maintain a weight that feels good to them as they move through any stage of this journey?

SPEAKER_02:

Right. And the the the thing about weight, and my number one question to my clients or potential clients is always, what's your what's your health goal? And nine times out of 10, they'll say weight loss. And then I'll say, Well, what does that mean to you? What what do you mean when you say weight loss? And you know, maybe I want to fit into, you know, when someone says I want to be what I was in high school and they're 50 years old, I'm like, that's not gonna happen. Let's be realistic about this. Maybe it's yeah, but but what I'm what I'm trying to cultivate in them is I want to be able to stay active and you know, be good with my with my, you know, go play soccer with my kids or play with my grandkids or get my my groceries out of the car and you know, be able to walk up and down steps.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So it's it's more of like, let's find out first what that goal is, and then let's work towards what your habits are now. What types of foods do you eat now, and let's see what we can change to help with the weight loss. It's sometimes it's easy for some people, depending on what they do. There's I had one client who lost six pounds in one week, but I will tell you it's only because she quit going to the drive-thru twice a day. So it depends. Everyone's got a different, you know, they're in a different place, right? Yeah. I mean, I love for people to lose half a pound to a pound a week just by changing their food. Nutrition's gonna be 80% of it. The other 20% is so important, but that 80% of food is gonna be the it's the foundation, it's where we start. Yes. Maybe, maybe they've never realized that dairy bothered them. Or maybe they never realized that wheat bothered them, or never maybe they never realized that red meat bothered them. I I don't know what it is, but until they start to think about it and maybe track it a little bit. Yeah, absolutely. And then we figure it out. But maintaining that weight loss, um, the clients that I've worked with that that lose weight, all they've really done is added whole nutrition, nutritious foods to their diet, and they've left out some of the bad stuff most of the time. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_00:

It does, yeah. Yeah. So the give people example of what the bad stuff, as you would call it, is. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So my big high horse was always, you know, processed food. Well, everything we eat pretty much has got some sort of processing, but the ultra, the ultra-processed food, like bagged chips and fried foods, foods with lots of dye in them, foods with lots of preservatives in them, which are gonna be the ultra-processed foods, because a lot of times it's not the food itself that's bad, it's the preservatives and the additives and all the dyes that are in there that cause people to maybe have their bodies inflamed.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So it the inflammation causes them not to be able to lose weight. So maybe you eat, you know, small bag of potato chips with your sandwich every day. Well, let's swap that that out to, you know, some a k an apple or some fruit, or maybe just half that bag of chips instead of the whole bag of chips. So those types of swaps that that I think are that make a big difference for people. But it's also the other thing too is it's probably overeating and not thinking about that you're that not recognizing when you're full. So a lot of my clients, we we talk about how to recognize when you're full and how the brain and the stomach take about 20 minutes to catch up with each other. So we work on those signals that the brain's going, you know, this is great, this is great, this is great. And this time it's going, oh my God, don't put another thing in me because I'm gonna burst if you do. You know, we don't want to get to that point anymore. So just learning how to eat mindfully, chewing slowly, watching your portions, eating with on you know, without interruptions, that kind of thing makes a big difference to a lot of I've seen that make huge difference to people.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes. Are you familiar with the book Women, Food, and God? I'm not oh my goodness. I will send you a link for that. Okay. And for the listeners, like here, hear me. That is such a good book. It's talks about so much of what's here. And part of her method is so it's all about healing women's relationship with themselves, with food, and with God. And a big part of her method is like we eat without distraction, like we really pay attention when we eat. We we almost create eating as a ritual, like a mindfulness practice or a spiritual practice of I'm nourishing my body and I'm going to notice. I'm gonna notice. I had a guest on my podcast recently, he's one of my teachers, Harshita Wagner, and he was talking about like even noticing the delight of the food and then when it stops delighting you, like all those different ways. Because I think part of one of the things that I see in my practice is earlier in life, you can lean on, like, for example, emotional eating is a coping strategy because your metabolism and everything going on with your hormones allow that. But then once you get in the midlife, that's no longer a tool that's really gonna serve you very well because you're gonna accumulate weight gain. You're gonna see some things happening in your body that you don't want to have. And part of the opportunity here is to be mindful about listening to your body in a different way. Like you can do it on the yoga mat, and that's awesome. And also do it when you're eating. Thank you so much for listening to the Nourished Woman podcast. I would love to hear what resonated with you and what you're carrying with you out into your life. Send me a message on Instagram at the Nourished Woman or even my email. Your messages really mean the world to me, so don't be shy. The beautiful music that you're hearing is by Sean Johnson and the Wild Lotus Band. You can find them on all streaming platforms. I'll see you next week for another episode.